Season 4, Episode 4 It’s Time to Stop Complaining: Surviving and Thriving in a State of Collective Trauma

It’s, it’s quite an interesting what I like to say evolutionary period in time.

Well, I also hope it’s a temporary period of time because it, the divisiveness in in the world and in the country, in addition to some of the health care concerns they do create a lot of anxiety and worry. And, you know, we certainly see we certainlysee clients who, despite the fact that the economy and markets and so forth have been reasonably strong over the last period of time and reasonably resilient through COVID, there’s still a fair amount of anxiety, not just about the health and about relationships, but about finances and about the future. Are you seeing people less optimistic right now than, than maybe ever before?

Yes I am, but I have to, I have to confess [00:03:00]Eric that for the last really, since may, I have been kind of somewhat sequestered up in the mountains of North Carolina and, and why that’s relevant to our conversation is that it’s, it’s a golf course community.

Pretty much overflowing with people who have retired or in are on the verge of retirement. So it’s been an interesting experience for me to watch and listen to the diversity of opinions about COVID and politics and you know, whether or not to wear a mask and whatnot, but then the financial aspects, as you said, because of course these are all pretty affluent business people and, you know, they’re, they watched the markets very closely, but you know, as you, and I’ve talked before I look at everything through a developmental lens. And so based on you know, my experience and what is perceived developmental stages, I’m seeing a level of scarcity. With some, even though they’re retired and have are affluent and then [00:04:00]others who are, who are not concerned at all.

So I really feel we’re kind of at a period where, you know, it’s a very transitional time in our historyand people are kind of all over the board, but what you see is where they were, for instance, if, if they were in scarcity probably throughout most of their life and career, whether it be for good or bad reasons, and by that, I mean, you know, many are just highly responsible people who take it to a level of scarcity. That’s that’s carrying forth into the way they’re, they’re living their retirement and you see it in real practical ways, like the way they access the amenities here or choose not to the way they want to get their money’s worth here versus going off the mountain into town for dinner, you know, those kinds of things. That’s quite fascinating to me.

I get the sense that while people are working and, you know, I’ve been at this 30 years and while people are working and they’re earning particularly higher high achievers, higher earners it’s a lot easier to have [00:05:00]an abundance mentality when, you know, next week there’ll be another deposit in your account as opposed to when you are retired.

And, and of course I put that in quotes because retirement means so many different things to different folks, but when you’re not necessarily earning a regular paycheck, whether that’s because you’re consulting or whether it’s because you’re moonlighting, whether it’s because you’re, you’re golfing every day and you’re not, do you know you’re not working anymore.

I think scarcity mentality starts to come when you realize that the nest egg you’ve built is the nest egg you’ve got, and now you have to make it last as long as your oxygen does. And I think that’s at any wealth level, I think that’s a mind shift, don’t you?

I do. And, and I, and I think that’s part of what I’m seeing is you’ll hear comments like the cashflow, you know, it’s all going out, but it’s not coming in, but, but it’s not true to, in, in the most literal sense, in my opinion, because most of these people of course have done the retirement planning and they have again, you know, [00:06:00]resources and however they’re set up.

I’m sure they have something coming in every month, but it’s, it’s different from what they’ve experienced to your point as an achiever. And, and just to remind you, I know you, and I’ve talked before about the 12 stages of development, the achiever stage and the expert stage, or where we like to, to think based on the latest research, it’s around 68% of the American workforce lands in those two stages. And the achievers stage really is known for their competitive spirit, which is where many business people and entrepreneurs live. You know, that’s why they’ve been successful. But they also have a tendency to chase money and they’re very goal oriented. And so when you don’t have those goals, when you don’t have, you know, the, the, the The, the, the opportunity to engage in the chase for money.

I think that’s where the scarcity, you know, can set in, even, even at the higher stages of wealth to some degree, because the chase is different. And I think sometimes people just have trouble [00:07:00]settling in to what that can look like. And it’s actually, I have to confess why my husband and I haven’t retired because we enjoy the work we do.

And we enjoy, we enjoy the differences we’re making, hopefully for other people. And we enjoy the chase.

Oh, well, I think the first thing is we have to recognize, and part of the message I gave the other day [00:15:00]is, you know, because people’s, I’m hearing. And I mean, literally Eric gets two to three times a week of someone’s daughter or granddaughter or grandson who’s, you know, having trouble in college and anxiety and depression and whatnot.

It’s, it’s very concerning to me. And I would say that a lot of that is coming from. You know, the, the constant level of negative information our youth are receiving, but also what they’re hearing from their parents and grandparents. So to me, the first thing is always in any system when we look at systems, systems are always trying to seek balance and equilibrium.

That’s what’s happening right now in our world. And why I say we’re in an evolutionary period, because when you hear allthe marginalized voices that are rising up, that is the system saying no more. We, we need to restore balance in our system. So we have to recognize that we are in an evolutionary period and that it does include collective trauma.

And the difference is that in, you know, years and years ago, [00:16:00]when I did this talk, for instance, I tried to look at how many events have we had that have been traumatizing, whether it be, you know, natural disasters or war or terrorism or mass shootings or whatever. Icould not count them. There there’s so many that have occurred over the last 20 years that we are in a constant state of collective trauma.Now, where you think back, if you look a worldhistory.com the 10 most dramatic events in world history, up to 1980,they were, they occurred far and few between, you know, it was world war one. It was world war II. It wasn’t a constant state of war. So the first thing is acknowledging that we are in a state of collective trauma and probably will be, maybe, forever unfortunately. So then as human beings, we have to protect our minds and our bodies and our spirit as well as our finances, which is where you come in. But it’s it’s to your point of watching what we read, [00:17:00]what we listen to, I would say the average American is not even aware that so much of what they’re watching and listening to is celebrity news intended to make millions and millions of dollars for the network or the individual, you know, person broadcasting. So to me, I listened to 20 minutes a day. That’s all I need to know what’s going on. I’m very careful what I read and I read and watch, and I get my clients to be very conscious as well of, you know, how they’re sleeping, how they’re eating, just the basics to fortify themselves against what’s coming at us because to your point when you look at, you know, what happened in the past, we were not inundated with the constant news and negativity that we are today because of social media. You know, it’s, it’s just overwhelming. So. To me that that’s the main thing. And then of course, if you’ve crossed over into anxiety or depression or any of those things, [00:18:00]you’ve got to seek the appropriate help and trauma experts are, are far more advanced in how to help people move through those stages of life.

You know, a regular psychologist may not always be as equipped, but I always send my clients to someone depending on the level of anxiety or trauma. And to be careful about that. Because we are, we are now prescriptive nation, meaning, you know, a doctor writes you a prescription for whatever you ask for and we’re medicating instead of getting to the root of what is going on with the individual. We’re treating, for instance, the anxiety, but not the source of the anxiety. And that to me is very, very important. Collective trauma is really becoming a mainstream conversation now that I think we need to be paying a lot of attention to.

Two weeks ago on, on our show, we had, we had a, a coach on who who talked about mental health and the, the confluence ofmental health and financial wellness. [00:19:00]And so it’s interesting that now, you know, two shows in a row, we’re having these conversations about some of the, some of the trauma and the anxiety and the depression.

And it’s very, very tough. Th th the next thing I wrote down, cause I told you I was making a couple of notes while we were chatting and collective trauma jumped off the page at me. But the other thing you said before you even mentioned the fact that our younger generations right now are looking for leadership, I had written down leadership void.

It is, it is so imperative that people step up and lead in positive ways. And yet finding examples of that are exceedingly difficult. And particularly when you start talking elected officials and I definitely don’t want to go down that rabbit hole, but my goodness, you know, it, it seems like disparaging others is, is how you’re climbing on top of that heap rather than, than standing for something, meaning something.

W what do we do with this leadership void? I mean, we certainly have programs to train people to lead, and some people are just born leaders, but where does their voice get [00:20:00]drowned out by what really is just noise? It’s such an interesting time because well, before I go there,I want to say one thing more about the collective trauma aspect, because, you know, we, the research is already starting, but we don’t really know and probably won’t see for at least 20 years, the impact of just the pandemic alone on our younger children,you know, it’s going to be quite interesting, the, the masks and the fear, and, you know, your parent gets COVID and you’re afraid they’re going to die. So we have, I think we have to just really pay attention to where our children are and what they’re watching and listening to, to just reiterate that one more time.

But then with respect to leadership, I have great hope for leadership in business. Zero hope for leadership in Washington, because I think we won’t see a change there for, for many generations, but, but for, for business, this amazing thing is happening that I’m sure you’re aware of Eric where, you know, we’ve got all these, these younger individuals who have [00:21:00]started up these platforms and they kind of throw the spaghetti up against the wall and they get the angel investors.

And if it works out great, if it doesn’t, they shut it down or if it, or if they can, they sell it and they move on to the next one. But, but many of them, most of them have not come up through the ranks of corporate America, the way we’ve seen in generations past. And therefore they’re not trained or equipped to be executives or CEOs.So I hear two things happening, which well, you know, one, one end concerns me. The other end is exciting is the youth my niece has had more jobs than I care to think of for instance. And, and when she tells me what’s happening from a leadership perspective and how she’s just thrown into a pool to do a job, she doesn’t even fully understand with no, no leadership at all, it, it breaks my heart to think that she’s having to go through this. But the good side is there are many of these leaders coming together and they’re meeting and creating their own summits, their own universities. That’s why masterminds [00:22:00]are now bigger than ever. And I love the fact that they’re coming together and they’re learning from one another, the really smart ones who are doing well.And I interviewed, you know, many, many of them on my show. The first two years I was running and I just loved the way they think. I love that they’re more value-based and that they hold each other accountable. So it’s a different kind of leadership development it’s score. It’s sort of. Hands-on, you know, you’re, you’re in the trenches.

We got to figure this out and let me talk to another guy who’s in the same boat who’s, who’s also building up, you know, multimillion dollar platform and I love that that’s happening. And I think that the business is going to be the answer to many of our social and economic problems because they are innovative and they’re doing what needs to be done.

You know, they’re, they’re the ones that pivoted, right. As soon as, as COVID hit where you see some of the other wheels turning far slower. I mean, my goodness, when we have a government that sends out, I don’t [00:23:00]know how many hundreds of thousands, maybe not that many, but certainly thousands of relief checks to dead people.I would say we have a serious problem in Washington because they’re antiquated in terms of how they do business and their, their technology compared to business. So on, on that note, I have great hope for leadership in this country on a business level. I just wish it would translate into our political systems.

And I don’t, I don’t see that happen.

No, sadly, I don’t either. And some of those folks who who the dead people who received checks also voted for those folks. I guess there’s a, a catch 22. If you get the vote, you get the check, right? I’m kidding people. Come on. I’m only kidding. All right. So let’s talk about your book a little bit because one of the things that, that I love about this and it, it, it jumped out at me as soon as I saw the title of your book, it’s not just about a prosperity. It’s about. And, and so talk a little bit about who the book is for and who [00:24:00]should pick this up and, and, and start diving in right away.

Well, I really, I know you, you know, a publicist never wants you to say this. I, I really wrote it for anyone and it’s taking very complex language around the experience of time and money from a developmental perspective and putting it into layman’s terms.

But obviously I, we anticipated in marketed more to the business community and I was very interested because I was seeing it so often in my clients that different. Individuals and no matter what their education, no matter how successful they were, had a different experience of both time and money. And, and I knew that time and money were, you know, they’re the two most important resources we have.

I mean, every day you’re making business and life decisions on how much time or money you have. It’s it’s our numbers. One conversation. So when I wanted to show the correlation between time and money, and I wanted to look at it through that developmental lens. And so just [00:25:00]as an example you know, we, when we think of development, you think of obviously birth, you know, a baby, obviously they’re not interested in time and money, but as you develop into the later stages, as I’ve, I’ve referenced earlier, your experience of time and money changes.

And so we know for sure. You know, the adolescent, you know, they, they are impulsive. They use money impulsively and they’re much more focused on their immediate needs. You know, that’s your teenager that comes in at two in the morning when he had a 10 o’clock curfew and he spent his whole allowance on, you know, iTunes or whatever.

But then we see, because in development, everything transcends and includes. So nothing is left behind whether it’s good or, or, or, or. A baby doesn’t for instance, forget to crawl. When they learn to walk, they just crawl less often. So it’s this it’s the same around money. I meet and often am quite stunned by 57 or 60 year old men who [00:26:00]have all the toys, you know, in the world, but then get behind on their mortgage.

So there’s a level of irresponsibility that they have. Conquered yet because they haven’t developed to a more sophisticated or responsible way of being in the world. And I’m sure you see that in your work all thetime is people who are totally surprised now that they’re 60 years old. You know, they haven’t prepared for retirement in some way, shape or form.

So I was interested in helping people understand that you don’t have to stay where you are, that if you havehealthy perspectives on time and money, good for you, keep going. But if you, if you don’t and you’re, and you have patterns where you’re constantly finding yourselves in precarious situations, That to me is a developmental issue and we can, you know, that’s part of what my coaching is.

I help people move to other developmental levels where they could experience a meaningful, prosperous life. And a [00:27:00]big part of that is stepping into stewardship. So part of the book is identifying what is stewardship and how do you, you know, master that if there is such a thing so that you can live a life because prosperity is not only about money, as I know, you know, You know, it’s, it’s about wellness and health and, and is my life you know, all that I want it to be.

And if not, what can I do to make the necessary changes to get there.

When you, when you talk about time and you talk about money I’m picturing that Seesaw sort of that balance that, that gets talked about so much. It’s like the work life balance while the idea is, if one goes up, the other goes down and it’s a they’re competing priorities in some way.

In the nonprofit world, the conversations often around time, talent and treasury. And the idea that when you’re young, you have an enormous amount oftime, but often no treasury and only budding talent. You’re in your thirties, forties, fifties, what have you, you still [00:28:00]might have some time, although you’re getting less and less of it, but your talent is growing and your treasury is growing.

And then you get to a certain point in your life, potentially where your talent has if not peaked, it’s certainly hit it it’s it critical mass. You may not feel the abundance of time anymore. So time becomes of the essence in a very different way, but you’re at your all time high in terms of treasury.

And you can start to use those resources to make a difference in your favorite non-profit or community or, or the world we’re in. So I love the idea that that time and money they are important resources, no question, but they’re also things that are, they’re both finite. They’re both important. But there’s that talent component that I think is, is also very interesting because there’s lots of ways to make a difference.

Sometimes you can make a difference by writing a check. Sometimes you can make a difference by spending time with someone and just listening to them. And sometimes you may make a difference because of your expertise. So I, I love what you’ve done. I hope people will pick up your book. We are at the point in our [00:29:00]show where I need an extra credit assignment and I know as a, a PhD, you are prepared to give us lots of homework. We don’t want any homework, just an extra credit assignment. Can you, can you do that for us?

Well, actually I, Ican. And I’m just quickly going to say that I had someone come up to me the other day and say how angry he was and he was having trouble handling his anger.

And my remark was turn off the television. Because I know he’s one that watches it a lot and he gets very upset by what he’s hearing and seeing. So I would challenge your listeners to go and going back to what I said earlier, just try it, try watching or listening whatever your, your mode of, you know, my husband accesses stuff through, you know, he reads the wall street journal and things like that on the internet.