Downsizing in Retirement: The Do’s and Don’ts

Cody Niedermeier: [00:00:00] Hello everyone. Welcome back. If, uh, if this is your second or third time joining us, this is our third webinar coming from BFG. Uh, if you don’t know me, my name’s Cody Niedermeyer, I’m an associate and I’m a CFP candidate, and I was lucky enough to, uh, get the honor of hosting these webinars. Um, as you can see, it’s only me online right now.

Cody Niedermeier: We’re just waiting for Eric to log on. There was some technical difficulties, but it’ll be on in a minute. And, um, today we’re going to be talking about downsizing and retirement and the do’s and the don’ts. So if you don’t mind just holding on one, Sarah, it’s on, we’ll get this thing started for everybody.[00:01:00]

Cody Niedermeier: Looks like you’re going on, Eric? Can you hear me?

Eric Brotman: I can hear you loud and clear. There’s nothing like a little it stuff to get us going. It’s 1102 to 1102 and it’s all my fault. So let’s do this. No,

Cody Niedermeier: it’s all good. I, uh, I gave a brief introduction on myself. Um, I wanted to wait to have you on the line before, uh, introducing you.

Cody Niedermeier: Of course, I gave everybody a heads up. We’re talking about downsizing in retirement, obviously, and the do’s and the don’ts because there’s definitely multiples of each and we’re going to break those down for everybody and make sure they [00:02:00] know. Um, for those that have listened in on the first webinar, uh, Eric was our guests and I gave him a lovely introduction.

Cody Niedermeier: He’s got way too many things to name. Uh, but for those of you new to this webinar, Eric Brotman is the CEO, the founder of Brotman financial group BFG. Uh, he’s the host of don’t retire, graduate the podcast where you put out numerous episodes on everything from downsizing in retirement. to intros to financial planning, and we’re lucky enough to grab a, grab an hour from you to, you know, pick your brain about downsizing in retirement so we really appreciate you joining us

Eric Brotman: now. It’s going to be fun. Let’s do it.

Cody Niedermeier: Let’s do it. So to get started, let me get this PowerPoint rolling. So compliance. We got to have everything and all the disclosures. And to begin when we’re looking into downsizing in retirement, we tend to look at, as it, as a graduation when we’re looking at retirement as a whole, is that correct?

Eric Brotman: [00:03:00] Absolutely. I, you know, retirement to me is not the absence of work. It’s the absence of needing to work. So we should be moving towards retirement, not away from it.

Cody Niedermeier: Absolutely. And kind of everything you do is building up to that. And you know, the idea of once you reach retirement, ideally, uh, you know, kids that you’ve had, they’re grown up, they’re moved out, uh, you know, it’s you and your significant other, and you know, you’re empty nesters now, and times have changed that, you know, that home that you’ve had for so long, you know, maybe it’s a little bit much, maybe, maybe it’s ready to look into that downsizing that we’re going to be talking about.

Cody Niedermeier: And, you know, income has changed. You don’t have as, as steady of an income coming in. So I guess the idea is, you know, what’s the ideology of people when kind of, they hit this point and they start to contemplate, you know, what are the next steps.

Eric Brotman: Well, I think the first thing to do is to sort of take inventory and to really look at your home in a very, through a different lens, [00:04:00] if you’re 55 or 60 or 65 years old, uh, hopefully you’re still not just young at heart, but you’re still physically active and, and doing lots of good things.

Eric Brotman: Um, you have to wonder whether the 80 year old version of yourself could still maintain the residence where you are, or whether at some point there’s likely to be a need for a change, whether it’s because of stairs, whether it’s because of, uh, landscaping yard work, uh, driveways to, to shovel or any of those kinds of things.

Eric Brotman: Um, you know, ultimately I think it. It’s the kind of thing you should really plan for and think about it in advance. You do not want to do this under duress, especially if you’re in a house you’ve been in for 40 years, you’ve accumulated in a massive amount of stuff. And probably you have stuff that still belongs to your kids and went off to college and never came back to claim it.

Eric Brotman: You might’ve stuff that came from your parents when they passed and you’ve got stuff everywhere and it doesn’t just magically disappear. You’re not going to want huge storage facilities [00:05:00] for stuff you haven’t looked at in 10 years. Um, and you’re not gonna want necessarily to, to, um, to have to find a place to move all of that.

Eric Brotman: So some of this is logistics, some of it is health related. Some of it’s, um, some of it’s geography, some of it’s just having conversations with your family. So I know we’re going to talk about a lot of these things in more detail, but the first best tip I can give you is give yourself a couple of years to really think about this and to plan it and to do it right, so that it’s not an emergency.

Cody Niedermeier: And I guess if you’re looking out, you know, 3, 5, 10 years in advance, You also got to take a look at, you know, your home features. If you’re going to get ready to sell the home that you have been in, you know, do we need to paint the walls? Do we need to, you know, get the windows done? Like, what’s the idea behind that? And, you know, the benefit of looking out so far in advance rather than having everything accumulated at one time,

Eric Brotman: uh, you know, yes, it’s a, it’s a process. There’s definitely some steps to look at taking. I don’t think it’s [00:06:00] necessarily this isn’t a linear thing. This isn’t the kind of thing that you’re going to look at and say, I’m doing it, or I’m not doing it.

Eric Brotman: It’s not binary. It’s a, it’s a spectrum, you know, is, is your next move going to be your last move or not? Are you, you know, what kind of, what kind of living situation do you want, where where’s your family, where’s your extended family geographically, you know, there’s, there’s a lot to think about more than just bricks and mortar in terms of getting a house ready to be.

Eric Brotman: A good real estate agent can come in and not only help you figure out what maybe needs to be touched up or repaired. Um, but also how to stage your house and today, you know, we’re sitting here in 2021. There’s never, I won’t say never there hasn’t been as good a time to downsize economically or financially for 14 years, 2007 was an amazing opportunity to do that.

Eric Brotman: And we all know what happened after the fact, but it’s a great time. It’s a great time to downsize. It is not a great time to upsize. So for [00:07:00] people who are selling houses are selling, you’re getting eight offers in a day, depending on your location. It’s selling for more than asking price. And there’s a, there’s an incredible shortage of properties for sale.

Eric Brotman: So if you’re looking to get out of the single family home and find a condo you’re going to sell for more than your home is probably worth, you might also be paying more for the condo than it’s worth, but the numbers are smaller. So it’s a great time to downsize.

Cody Niedermeier: I mean, that’s a lot to take in and taking all that into consideration.

Cody Niedermeier: Um, I think one of the other benefits of, you know, if you do this advanced planning kind of going into everything and you’re checking off all the boxes is I know personally my goal when I graduated into retirement is, you know, I want that to be my relaxing years. I don’t want to have these things that, as I’ve said before, accumulated over time where I’m trying to do everything at once, when you know, I should be, oh, this is the next step.

Cody Niedermeier: I’m finding my way to the beach somewhere relaxing, and then enjoying everything I’ve worked for my entire working [00:08:00] career.

Eric Brotman: I agree with you that you want to be in a position where you can enjoy your, um, the third trimester of your life, which really is what it could be is a third of your life and half of your adult life.

Eric Brotman: Um, and being idle and feeling like it’s a vacation sounds compelling, but you cannot spend 30 years that way and still thrive. So it’s important to be financially independent. And we’ve talked about that on our show and in the books and all different things. It’s important to be financially independent, but not to be idle.

Eric Brotman: So having a place that doesn’t require a lot of maintenance is a great thing. Taking things you don’t like doing, and don’t want to do off your plate is a smart thing. Creating a situation where you’re on constant vacation will get old. Believe it or not, maybe not in a week, maybe not in a month, but there’s only so many golf courses.

Eric Brotman: There’s only so many. You, you can only spend so much time under an umbrella and, and you know, on the beach. And I’m not saying that’s not a valuable thing. It’s incredibly [00:09:00] valuable to have leisure in your life later in your years. But, um, it can’t be the only thing you have.

Cody Niedermeier: Yeah. And, you know, retirement might be over reduced workload compared to, you know, the 40, 50, 60 hour weeks that you were putting in before it, because it’s something you enjoy.

Cody Niedermeier: You know, being, or consulting or, you know, just an aspect of what you’ve done for however many years getting into retirement.

Eric Brotman: No, that’s right. And you know, we’ve, we’ve put together, I’ve put together a list of sort of the do’s and don’ts the things to consider, uh, specific for this. Um, the first thing is to give yourself plenty of time, so of everything you’re going to do, that’s the most important one in my opinion.

Cody Niedermeier: Okay, well, I guess building off of this, you know, we’ve been planning for a few years and you know, now we’ve got to decide, you know, what type of home we want to live in, you know, what is our best fit? Do we want a standalone house? Uh, do we want to live in a 55 and up community that has, you know, events and you can be social, [00:10:00] uh, I guess it’s really diving into what you want your future years to look like.

Cody Niedermeier: And, you know, these decisions are huge of what you’re trying to figure out. You know, this downsizing framework is built around.

Eric Brotman: Definitely. And, and some, some of these options will appeal to people, um, to some people and not to other people. So for example, some people love condo living because it’s virtually maintenance free.

Eric Brotman: Other people would feel like caged animals in a condo. They need a backyard. You know, if, if you like, you know, if you like feeding the birds and you like, um, you know, you like mowing the lawn, you’re going to miss not having a lawn strangely. I don’t mow a lawn, but some people do. Um, condo living is not for everyone for some people.

Eric Brotman: It’s great. It’s maintenance-free for other people, they’re hearing their neighbors and it’s irritating them. They’re the kind of people who hit the floor or the ceiling with a broom handle. You know what I mean? Then that’s not for you. Um, in terms of single family home, [00:11:00] the thing to consider is are there stairs, are there ranchers, ranchers were very popular at one point in this country.

Eric Brotman: They’re less abundant now, but this idea that you can have a property and you can have all of your living space on one floor, What about a two story home, but the master bedrooms on the first floor and the master bath is on the first floor. You know, you can still have your family over to visit. They can still stay there’s guest rooms upstairs, but don’t have laundry one or two flights of stairs away from you.

Eric Brotman: It’s not, that’s not going to work at some point. Um, you know, townhouse living for the most part for retirees is not the best because it’s vertical. So, you know, you want as few stairs as possible. Um, what is the egress and, uh, you know, uh, ability of the place, and I’m not suggesting we’re all going to be invalid.

Eric Brotman: It’s just that knees and hips wear out, you know, their parts. Um, and then in terms of, uh, over 55 community, I’m very glad Cody, despite what you think of me, I’m not eligible for those yet. Um, but an over 55 community is great for people who want to be [00:12:00] active with their peers. And you find a place with biking trails and hiking trails on a clubhouse and a pool and restaurants.

Eric Brotman: And that’s like living on a college campus without having to go to class. That’s a pretty good deal. Um, then there’s other folks who like the continuing care community idea, where, and depending on your age, um, where you move in and you have independent living options and you stay there and you have your own apartment or your own home for as long as you’re able, but at the point in time where you need any type of assisted living, you have that available on site.

Eric Brotman: And should you ever be in a position where you need intense 24 hour type nursing care. It exists right there as well. And you, you have sort of a, an entry ticket if you have to go there, none of us want to go there. Um, but if you have to and let’s face it, people do. Um, yeah, it’s nice to know that it’s already taken care of and you have a place to go. That does not mean you can necessarily afford it.

Eric Brotman: There’s affordability, um, of, of these kinds of options. You know, some, some of these communities require [00:13:00] many hundreds of thousands of dollars to buy into and others are just monthly rent. So it really is going to depend on your wherewithal. One of the reasons to plan ahead is to figure out how you’re going to use the equity in your own home to make this happen. We see lots of folks who are able to downsize a home and potentially get two homes where they, they get rid of the big single family home. And now they’re bicoastal or they have a place in, uh, they’ve become Florida residents, but still have a small place wherever they’re from so that they’re taking advantage, not only of the tax code, but of the weather.

Eric Brotman: Some people do not want to winter in Wyoming. Other people love that. So, you know, we’re all different. I, I think it’s good to figure out what you need to be near and what kind of property you want, how much work do you want to have to do? How much expense do you want to have to handle. Condos are great. Condo fees will cover almost everything outside of your walls. And you have to, when you’re looking at a condominium, you have to look at the replacement reserves and you have to look at the bylaws and you have to look [00:14:00] at the, at the financials of the condo association before you buy in, because you don’t want to be facing big assessments.

Eric Brotman: And unfortunately that happens. So it’s helpful to either review them yourself if you have the acumen to look at those financial documents or request help from your financial advisor or realtor.

Cody Niedermeier: Wow. I mean, we’re hitting on a lot of different options, but let’s say, you know, I’m looking at my retirement in a few years. What are some of the best resources, you know, to gather the different information on each of these, other than this webinar? Um, but I’m trying to get some more specific information. Am I just, you know, searching online, plugging in and Google, or are there people that I can reach out to that, you know, can kinda help with the process of, you know, looking into different aspects of each one to kind of decide what’s right you know, for me, for me and my significant other or anything along those lines,

Eric Brotman: I think it begins with having a really high quality real estate agent who can be a buyer’s agent for you. [00:15:00] On the seller side, they’re going to help you figure out how to sell your home. But on the buyer side, they can really help guide you because they’re going to know the communities, they’re going to know the area.

Eric Brotman: And a lot of times, if you’re moving, especially if you’re moving out of the area or moving out of state, you’re going to need to be referred to somebody who really knows that area. And that state, I would not do an, uh, a random online search for that necessarily. I would ask for one of your advisors to help you find uh, someone in that location and you know, if you’re moving to Bozeman, Montana, we may not know somebody there, but, but certainly by two or three degrees of separation, we can help you find somebody who’s not out of the yellow pages. Um, you do remember the yellow pages , Cody? That was a long time ago.

Eric Brotman: Yeah. Um, so, so that’s, that’s one piece of this. And the, the other piece is if you’re at a position where you’re looking at continuing care communities, there are resources. And we actually have some here locally resources for people who really know those, um, those communities and can help find the right community for you when you’re, if, and [00:16:00] when you’re at that stage.

Eric Brotman: And a lot of people do this for their parents. You have your 55 and mom and dad are in their eighties. You might be involved in helping them find a place to go as well. So it’s not just about yourself. It’s about your extended family.

Cody Niedermeier: Wow. But so the resources are out there and, you know, usually within a financial advisor’s network you’re able to find somebody somewhere that, you know, there is a relationship of some way, like you said, two, three degrees where, you know, it’s better than plugging in to Google and feeling like you’re alone in the entire process, which we’re going to dive deeper into later when we examine, you know, building your team, that’s going to help you get there.

Cody Niedermeier: Sure. But you’ve actually already touched on a little bit, but I definitely want to dive deeper in, on, you know, the geography idea and where do you want to be, or do you want to be near your kids? Do you want to be bicoastal? Like you said, um, do you want to move somewhere where there’s tax efficiencies and you know, I just, I kind of want to gain some insight into your mind of which is a scary place we don’t know [00:17:00] of, of what you think is important in considering when you’re looking into the geography of where you want to be.

Eric Brotman: First thing is I would caution folks not to let the tax tail wag the financial dog. Okay, because while there are less expensive options, price is only one issue to consider. And that’s not only real estate prices, but also tax ramifications. So to move to someplace, you don’t want to be because it saves you a few percent in the state income tax or because the real estate taxes are lower or because the housing prices are lower isn’t the recipe for happy. It’s a recipe for cheap, but you’re going to travel more because you’re not gonna want to be home. Um, so, uh, geography really, I think it starts with where your family is. If you’re, if you are, if you have children, if you have grandchildren, do you want to be near them? And that matters.

Eric Brotman: I think there’s a weather component to this. Some people prefer to be in a Southern climate. Um, some people prefer to have two small places rather than one larger one. And that’s certainly an option. [00:18:00] Um, I think you have to consider what you do for fun. You know, if, if you enjoy the beach, I would submit that Iowa is not the place to retire because there’s not a lot of beaching happening in, in the Midwest.

Eric Brotman: So some of it comes down to, what do you like to do? Do you like to bike? Do you like to hike? Do you like, do you like wine country? Do you like, um, uh, do you like the beach? Do you like, uh, do you want, do you need to be near an airport? Is it important for you to be able to travel so that you’re not sort of in the middle of nowhere?

Eric Brotman: Do you want to be in a more urban setting where you can walk to various things? You can walk to the cafe or you can walk to the corner store or do you want to be someplace idyllic where you’re overlooking a lake or something, but you you’re 30 minutes from a grocery store. You know, so, and, and a lot of that’s changing now with delivery of groceries, and certainly you can shop from home for anything now.

Eric Brotman: So in some cases that’s less important than it used to be, but how, how big a deal is population density? You want to be close to friends and [00:19:00] people and sort of the buzz of the street, or do you want to hear crickets? And everyone’s different and there is no right answer. If there was a right answer, that’s the only place people would live and it would get very crowded.

Eric Brotman: So it’s good that we all like different things.

Cody Niedermeier: Very true. Very true. So, you know, we figured out where we want to be. We started to take a look at everything, but, you know, we need to, oh, I’m sorry. How do we get that understanding of, you know, our entire world, our entire financial world and independence of where we are now, so we can get to that right.

Eric Brotman: This is a very easy question when you’re 35 or 45 or 55 and incredibly more and more challenging questions as you get older. And the biggest reason that this gets more challenging is twofold. One. You’re preparing to make decisions you’ve never made before. So whether you’re in your first job or your third job, whether you’re 25 or, or 45, you’re used to putting money away, you’re used to saving money.

Eric Brotman: You’re used to trying to grow your money. [00:20:00] You’re used to putting into your 401k or your HSA or your joint account or saving for your kids. You’re used to making deposits and trying to grow money. What you’ve never done before is try to figure out how best to utilize it, how to spend it in a way that’s sustainable.

Eric Brotman: You’ve never, people have never, ever had to do it before. And they’re not prepared for how much more difficult it is. Then just adding X dollars a month to an accountant and watching it grow. The, the hard part here is that every dollar is not treated the same, a dollar coming out of an IRA or a 401k is different than a dollar coming out of your bank.

Eric Brotman: Because if it’s sitting in the bank, there’s no taxes. If it’s sitting in an IRA, you’re going to pay whatever ordinary income tax there is on the dollar. So it’s not really a dollar. It might be depending on your tax bracket, it could be only 60 cents you could spend, or it could be 85 cents. So planning for taxes on your income matters as much as how much, how much principal you have. Then you have to think, what does [00:21:00] financial independence mean a long period of time? No, we’re going to live longer than most of us imagined. Yeah. Um, and what that means is that life is going to be more expensive than we expect. For longer than we can possibly fathom. A lot of people look at how old their parents were when they died and assume that’s when they’re going to go.

Eric Brotman: That might be anecdotally interesting, but it certainly isn’t scientific. Um, yes. Genes play a role and yes, biology of course is, is an important factor, but so is how well you take care of yourself. So is your stress level, your, your quality of life, um, your diet, your exercise, all the things you do to take care of yourself.

Eric Brotman: How long are you gonna be here in a perfect world? Um, and I see a lot of financial plans that run what are called Monte Carlo simulations. And I want to go on record as saying, I despise Monte Carlo simulations. First of all, anything that’s a simulation is automatically, there’s a gaming element to it.

Eric Brotman: But the problem with Monte Carlo simulations is it will give you a report that says based [00:22:00] on current inputs and all the assumptions we’re making, you have an 89% chance of being absolutely fine when you’re 85. And I’ll look at that and say, well, you have an 11% chance of a serious problem. And moreover, what if you’re 86?

Eric Brotman: I think any plan that is only good to a certain point. Is probably not a good plan. It is much better to be financially independent, such that you can draw on the assets that you have or create income from the assets that you have indefinitely. So that there’s little or no chance of running out of money.

Eric Brotman: And ideally you can still grow it for inflation because if you’re 70 today and you’re here for another 25 years, the price of groceries will not be lower in 25 years taxes, won’t be lower. You’re going to be paying bills that don’t exist today in 25 years. 25 years ago we didn’t have internet service providers or cell phones or, or all the things, the streaming services.

Eric Brotman: They didn’t exist. Now they’re in everyone’s monthly budget. So planned obsolescence happens. [00:23:00] So there’s going to be bills that we have in 10 years, that we don’t have today for any number of things. Some of them we’ll be engineering. Some of them will be technology. Some of them will be leisure. Some of them will be medical care.

Eric Brotman: So what I would strongly say, I guess, to people is that they understand not only what that financial independence will look. But how to navigate it, how much money do you really need in order to retire with dignity, um, in a way that you can’t outlive it. And it’s a big number, especially for people in their twenties and thirties.

Eric Brotman: So we have folks on this webinar who are younger, who are looking at this saying, oh my gosh, that’s way off in the future. First of all, like everyone else who is turning 50 and I am this year, embarrassingly like everyone else turning 50, who said, oh, it’s way off, now I’m like, how did this happen? But seriously, it happens really fast.

Eric Brotman: And, and so that means while time is on your side, it’s the right time to be planning in advance because the number, the amount of money, Cody, that you will need to [00:24:00] retire based upon your current lifestyle and based on inflation over the next 30 or 40 years is going to be a massive number that right now looks horrifying, but it won’t look horrifying in 40 years.

Eric Brotman: It’ll look like the same thing you have now. So if inflation is 3%. The cost of everything doubles every 18 years. So let’s, let’s flesh that out. Um, I’m sorry. Every 24 years I’m rushing things. It’s every 24 years. So if you’re 25 years old, you can expect that at 49, the cost of everything will be doubled assuming a 3% inflation rate.

Eric Brotman: Well, that means it’ll be double at, at 49 or call it 50. It will be quadruple at 75. So if, if every dollar you make right now needs to be $4 in 50 years just to pay the bills the same as you do today. Assuming all things are equal. The numbers going to look massive because for every, if you’re pulling 4% from your account, [00:25:00] every million dollars today creates $40,000 a year of income.

Eric Brotman: You may or may not want to live on $40,000 a year of income, but if you multiply that by four 50 years from now, That’s $160,000. That’s what you would just for the $40,000 income today. So you have to start thinking about big numbers. It’s not enough to say I’m a millionaire, I’m done. A million dollars, a million dollars will throw off enough money to keep you below the standard of living for the United States.

Eric Brotman: That’s kind of horrifying.

Cody Niedermeier: No, it is. And you know that numbers, I mean, as you said, it’s a lot bigger, especially when, you know, we have people closer to my age than yours. We’re not going to throw out any numbers, but I think this leads perfectly into the last, do you think people should do of, you know, how we see that number?

Cody Niedermeier: We’re intimidated. How do we get there? And it’s building the team around you. So I was hoping to kind of, you know, a [00:26:00] financial advisor, a tax advisor and kind of each one. Yeah. Get the perspective of what we should be looking for and you know, who should be a part of our team? Uh, I guess big picture of helping us reach these goals.

Eric Brotman: There are a couple of different ways to approach this that is that that will resonate with people. So let’s use, let’s use a medical analogy. Okay. I don’t know very many people who choose not to have a primary care physician, whether it’s because their health insurance requires it or whether it’s because they think it’s a good idea where they want that relationship.

Eric Brotman: And there’s lots of different kinds of primary care physicians. Some are concierge medicine, and some are your family practitioners and so forth, but most people have a primary care physician. It is the primary care physicians role typically to help their patients find the specialist they need. Okay. So I would not expect the random person to say, you know what? I think I need a podiatrist and an oncologist. That that’s that doesn’t, that’s not the way it [00:27:00] works. You’re gonna have a doctor say, you know, there’s something showed up here and I think you need a dermatology appointment and you need to see somebody about your, about your blood pressure. So some of it’s going to be, how do you work with a generalist work with a primary care financial expert, which is your financial advisor who can help you figure out which specialist you need, because they’re going to vary

Eric Brotman: you’re not going to need a real estate agent every year. You’re not going to need an estate planning attorney every year. You probably need a CPA or a tax preparer every year. So some of them are going to be recurring. Some of them are going to be occasional. No. How often do you need a mortgage banker or a mortgage broker?

Eric Brotman: Well, anytime you do a transaction or when you’re refinancing or, you know, when you’re, when you’re buying another home, but that doesn’t typically happen every year. Recently it has because interest rates kept going down and everyone kept refinancing, but that’s almost over. So, uh, I think it’s important not only to have the right people.

Eric Brotman: But to make sure that they all talk to one another, or at least that there’s a clearing house of information so [00:28:00] much like medical records. And I’m going to go back to this because people can, can sort of understand the way that feels. If you see a specialist you want your specialist’s report to get to your primary care physician, to review it, you want all of them to have access to your blood, your blood results or your other tests, you know, you want, um, certainly if you’ve got multiple doctors, potentially prescribing prescriptions for you, you want to make sure that prescription from Dr a and prescription from Dr. B, aren’t going to counteract each other or put you in the hospital. And so from a financial standpoint, that means it’s important for your insurance agent and your estate attorney to be on the same page when it comes to things like beneficiaries, it’s important for your, for your mortgage broker and your financial advisor to work together, to figure out not how much house can you afford, but what is a sensible decision?

Eric Brotman: Because if you just go to some of these specialists on their own, and they’re only looking at you in a vacuum, they’re notgonna know enough about you to tell you how much you ought to spend on a house. They’re going to tell you how much you can do [00:29:00] qualify for. Well, just because you can qualify for it doesn’t make it a good idea. And Cody right now in your life, if you were going to buy a home tomorrow, um, and all people knew about you was your age, your income and your net worth. And that’s all I know. I show you five people with the same age, income and net worth, who would not want the same kinds of houses.

Eric Brotman: You might have three children where somebody else doesn’t have any. Or you might be married, or you might be planning to be single. Like, just because you can qualify for it doesn’t mean it’s good for you. Um, you know, well, and that’s one of the things we talk about medicine. You talk about the pharma, the pharma commercials, which drives me nuts, but my daughter’s 11 and she already watches those and she’s like, there’s 48 side effects. Like what, why would we go to our doctor to say, you know what, I think I need X, Y, Z pill. We shouldn’t, we should have a primary care physician that says, you know, I’m not happy with your cholesterol levels. We need to look at [00:30:00] various options or I’d like you to do this test.

Eric Brotman: Or I’d like you to see this specialist. You shouldn’t be going to your doctor saying, you know, I heard about this purple pill. It sounds like a good idea. Should I be on this? And you’re laughing because it sounds stupid, but that’s what people do with their financial stuff. You know, someone will, will spend a bunch of money on a perfect estate plan and then not update their beneficiaries and their ex-wife gets their 401k when they die.

Eric Brotman: That’s not pretty, um, or, or, you know, you’ve, you’ve got a life insurance contract and you’ve named your, your family the way you’ve intended to, but then you had more children and you never update. Or you wanted to make a charitable gift and you made it from accounts. That didn’t make sense. So coming back specifically to the housing process, uh, I think it’s, it’s important to have a real estate agent.

Eric Brotman: I would not buy a home without a real estate agent. You want that advice. You want someone who understands, who understands not only what it looks like and how the neighborhood works and sort of sorta some things like that and [00:31:00] the decorative piece, but you also want somebody who’s going to get you the right home inspector.

Eric Brotman: Who’s going to take a look. Who’s going to check the pipes and kick the tires, so to speak. It’s not enough to have it look pretty. I bought a house in 2007, so helped me. It was like buying a used car from somebody who got it detailed every Saturday, but had never changed the oil. Really? Yeah. I mean, everything was beautiful.

Eric Brotman: Immaculate. Perfect. Until you got into the guts of the house and you realized they hadn’t cared for anything and the systems were a mess. Um, and that’s when you, when you buy a house it’s real important. And I will freely admit I did not have the right home inspection. I did not have some of the right advisors.

Eric Brotman: Um, I learned from that, but I learned an expensive lesson. And so now I’m trying to share with other people what not to do, not because I’m perfect and I’m not making mistakes anymore. I’m just trying not to make the same mistake twice. I’ll make all new mistakes, Cody, but I don’t want to make that one again.

Eric Brotman: So it’s going to make that point for you. I appreciate you. Uh, yeah. So, so in that particular case, [00:32:00] having the right specialist, that means if you’re selling your home, it means it means having the right person stage it, or do the video shooter or put, uh, put the sales package together. But it also means, uh, understanding what the tax ramifications of the sale are.

Eric Brotman: Somebody you might be thinking, do I sell this house or do I rent it when I buy my next one? Okay. Well, if you just go, well, mortgage person, they’re not going to tell you what to do with that. Or a real estate agent. They might say, oh, you can get about $1,200 a month for rent. But they don’t know your tax picture.

Eric Brotman: They don’t know your investible assets. They don’t know your credit score. They don’t know that you’ve got, they don’t know that you’ve got $30,000 of student loans still to deal with because they don’t need to know that they’re not thinking so the specialist should work together, but there should be a gatekeeper, a, a clearing house for information.

Eric Brotman: And in general that your financial planner, your CFP, um, but specifically when it comes to housing, let your financial advisor help guide you along with your realtor. Um, find out how much [00:33:00] house makes sense for you. Not how much you can qualify for find out is, is this, um, you know, and I don’t know anything necessarily about the neighborhoods we’re going to need the specialist too, it’s not like you can do it without the specialist, but know who they’re going to be and make sure they work together.

Eric Brotman: I think that’s really important. Yeah,

Cody Niedermeier: no, that makes a lot of sense. And you know, as you’re giving the, the medical analogy or example, I just, I’m a team guy. I love sports. I’m thinking about an offensive coordinator and a quarterback for a football team. And I’m thinking, you know, everybody else around the mortgage broker, and everybody’s a part of the team, the offensive coordinator gives a play and you know, the quarterback goes out or the client, or, you know, whoever it may be goes out and, you know, executes those plays, but everybody’s working together for one common good.

Eric Brotman: Yeah. That’s one of the reasons why pro bowls are no fun to watch. At the end of the day you want to have, you want to have strategy, but you also want to have communication. And if, if your team works together, you will not only spend less money, you will make fewer [00:34:00] mistakes and you’ll wind up with better results.

Eric Brotman: And that doesn’t mean a better investment return, necessarily. Some of those things happen regardless of who your folks are, but you’re certainly going to be able to make better decisions. And that’s about housing and other things.

Cody Niedermeier: No, absolutely. Um, do you have any more thoughts on things people need to do before, you know, looking to downsize in retirement? Because after this slide, we’re going to start looking at the things we want people to avoid when they’re, uh, when they’re looking to take that next step in their life.

Eric Brotman: I think what we should do is, uh, we should avoid the three don’ts that are coming. Let’s start with that. Let’s go there and talk about some of those, and then we’ll circle back and see if there’s any questions.

Cody Niedermeier: Sounds good to me. And once again, anybody, you know, watching and listening in to this webinar, if you do have any questions, go ahead and post them. If, uh, Eric and I have time at the end, I’ll, uh, I’ll pull a few of those and, uh, we’ll be able to pick his brain about that as well. So getting into the don’ts. Everybody ages, you touched on it [00:35:00] earlier, you know, at some point, those knees start to go, the elbows start to hurt and, you know, I personally, I think I’m immaculate.

Cody Niedermeier: I’m gonna, you know, I’m never going to have any issue. Um, you know, why should I not be thinking like that?

Eric Brotman: First of all, because you often lose to a 50 year old man on the Peloton for the record. So let’s start with that. Now, the impact of aging, the impact of aging effects, all of us at some point and all of us in different ways.

Eric Brotman: Sometimes it’s physical and we talk about stairs and we talked about those kinds of things, but sometimes, sometimes it’s cognitive. You know, one of the reasons why BFG has been so involved with the Alzheimer’s association and doing some of the fundraising we’re doing is because cognitive impairment and dementia is such a, a train wreck for families.

Eric Brotman: It’s such a, um, emotionally taxing and financially taxing piece. So, um, the impact of aging. Is it’s cognitive, it’s logistics. It’s a [00:36:00] physical and planning for that requires, um, it requires some dexterity, you know, you, you, for example, um, do you need long-term care insurance? Some people would say, absolutely everyone should have it.

Eric Brotman: Some people would say, no one should have it. It’s a lousy deal. I would say it’s not binary that way. And there are cases where it makes a ton of sense in cases where it doesn’t. But if you’re in a position where you’re married, And you’re buying that house and you’re downsizing to do this and you’re, you’re choosing the right spot.

Eric Brotman: How do we make sure that if one of you gets sick, it doesn’t derail the whole, the whole plan so that’s part of it. Um, another is, uh, I know a lot of people who are, you know, 65 and are starting companies or doing consulting and they’re active. And, you know, they’re, they’re, they’re still in the, the, the motorcycle commercials going across the country kind of thing, and there, and that’s awesome.

Eric Brotman: And if you can do that until you’re 90, go for it, but a lot of people can’t [00:37:00] and so having a middle step, having another move can be extremely difficult. Moving at 60 or 65 is it can be hard. Moving at 80 can be traumatic and so if you can avoid that middle step, I think there’s not only a cost savings, but there’s an emotional savings to that.

Eric Brotman: I also think there’s a, a fundamental desire for all of us. We all want our, our freedom. We all want our independence and keeping that as long as possible matters. Um, and potentially that means having a place where you can get any kind of care you need as an older person potentially at home. So it starts with a master bedroom on the first floor or no stairs, but it continues to can this bathroom be accessible?

Eric Brotman: Can it be made accessible for somebody who maybe is having trouble showering for themselves? You know, th th things that we’re not necessarily attuned to thinking about, and we don’t want to picture, none of us can picture ourselves frail in that way, [00:38:00] but that, that happens, you know, you said parts wear out it’s true parts wear out.

Eric Brotman: So I think understanding the impact of an illness, not only on your finances, but on your living situation is a big deal. And if you’re, if your spouse is 15 years younger than you are, um, you know, he, or she may be in a very different position, they’re in a different spot along this trajectory. So you might be thinking, I want to downsize to a condo and she might be thinking, are you kidding?

Eric Brotman: I’m still, I’m still in the prime of my life doing, doing things I want to do. I don’t want to do that. And so communicating with your spouse is real important because, um, someone 70 knows what it feels like to be 55, but someone 55 doesn’t know what it feels like to be 70. And I don’t know how to put yourself in somebody else’s shoes that way in any, uh, in any way, other than intellectually. Emotionally, we can’t know what that feels like.

Eric Brotman: And the same, thing’s true. Just in general, finances for people who are 30 or 40 and, and take a [00:39:00] hit financially. A business, doesn’t go well or an investment doesn’t go well, or something goes wrong. There’s sort of this tendency to, to, to sort of get yourself up, you brush off the dirt and you get back at it and you go make more.

Eric Brotman: There’s a point in people’s lives where sometimes they can’t go make more. And so this, it, it changes the psychology behind financial decisions. So if you buy a place that is some kind of historic home, that’s going to require special types of upkeep, or it’s going to eventually require a really expensive roof or whatever it is, you might love the place, but there may come a point where just maintaining it becomes hazardous to you because you’re not in a position to just go make more money.

Eric Brotman: And so things that often don’t get talked about or thought about become important as you start to think about the impact of aging, not only on your physical wellbeing and your cognitive wellbeing, but also on your income potential. Yeah. [00:40:00]

Cody Niedermeier: I feel like it’s just really, like, this is a tough subject to talk about with clients or, you know, people that are reaching that age because they don’t want to think about, you know, not their downfall, but those years where, you know, things start to get harder.

Cody Niedermeier: Uh, how, how do you get them to start having that conversation? I know it’s probably similar to a lot of what you’re saying right now, but. Getting them on board with understanding kind of, you know, this is what we’re planning for, um, and to kind of communicate with each other, what they’re trying to do.

Eric Brotman: Yeah. I think that goes into one of the, one of the next don’ts, which is not to keep this a secret. Is that right? That’s too out. It’s too out. Well, let’s go out of order then Cody, this is a great idea. Let’s go over. The good news is we’re not scripted at all, so, all right. Don’t keep your plans a secret. If so, what do, what do I try to do when working with families?

Eric Brotman: I try to make sure that there’s good communication about all financial topics. This is definitely one of them, and that means not only between spouses, [00:41:00] but at any stage of your life, but it also means between generations. So I can’t tell you how often I ask a question of, you know, new, new clients coming in and they’re, they’re in their forties or fifties.

Eric Brotman: And, um, and I’ll, I’ll look at the two of them and say, how long do you plan to stay in the house? And I’ve heard this happen. This actually happens where the husband will go. You know what? We’re going to be there forever. This is the house. And the wife will say, you know, maybe nine months, 12 months, and they’ve never discussed it.

Eric Brotman: And they look at each other dumbfounded that she can’t believe he wants to stay. And he can’t believe she wants to go. And it does happen. And so in that particular case, I looked at him and I said, get some boxes. Um, you’re in charge of nothing. That’s marriage, but, uh, but the reality is people don’t talk about these things and it’s nice to be able to do it with a, uh, an independent party because I don’t have, I don’t have skin in that game.

Eric Brotman: We can talk about whether it makes sense to stay or go, and we can look at it very [00:42:00] objectively without it, without it getting emotionally heated, hopefully, and with it being very transparent. Same thing’s true with multiple generations. Your mom and dad want to stay in that house forever. Imagine right now that you had to take your car keys away from one of your parents

wouldn’t be an easy conversation.

Eric Brotman: When no, and it’s not something your parents want either. In fact, they’re thinking over my dead body, Cody, you’re not getting keys from me. It’s not stubborn, it’s independent and fiercely independent. And none of us ever want to acknowledge that we need help with those kinds of things.

Eric Brotman: In fact, some people have trouble asking for help for things that we all need help for. You know, we w we don’t stop and ask for directions and thank goodness for GPS, that embarrassment is over, but, but there’s, there’s plenty of things that people don’t talk about unless they’re prodded to do so. And so, you know, we run family summits for, um, clients and their extended [00:43:00] families to talk about, to talk about not only what’s important, but to make sure that visions and values are shared.

Eric Brotman: But also to share concerns. If you’re worried about mom and dad, you know, mom is 83 and we’re worried it’s helpful to have a conversation. First of all, while she’s cognitively able to. And second of all, in a safe spot where it’s not duress, it’s so important to have good open communication and to make good decisions while everyone’s able, because once you’re not able to either, either medically or you’re not here anymore, or whatever you have to live with, everyone else has to live with whatever was decided before.

Eric Brotman: There’s no way to improve it. It’s one of the reasons why I started my career, you know, in the early nineties, I was working for a brokerage firm in the legal department and I was helping people deal with the states and I was helping people deal with, uh, you know, I’m sorry you lost your, your, your mom or dad or your spouse.

Eric Brotman: Here’s what needs to happen to take the next steps, but I couldn’t help them plan anything. I could tell them which Ts to cross, which Is to dot, which [00:44:00] form needed to be filled out. But I couldn’t change the fact that they accidentally named your brother and not you as beneficiary. Sorry. And so the, the mistakes that made then get amplified because it’s at a time of trauma or tragedy.

Eric Brotman: And so to have your parents tell you, we want to stay in this house as long as we can. That’s well, and good. Have a plan B, know what the plan B is going to be. It’s kind of like the in case of, in case of emergency break glass, what is, what is the plan? What are their wishes in case they can no longer make that decision or what are their wishes in case there needs to be intervention.

Eric Brotman: And let’s hope that open communication will allow them to share that with you and tell you what’s important. You don’t want to do something to them. You want to do things for them. Yeah.

Cody Niedermeier: And then having your financial team in place as well, working with your financial advisor is, you know, you’re forced to have these conversations of what do, what does retirement look like earlier on as you’re planning for it. So it, there’s not as many curve balls [00:45:00] that can come up, uh, when the time does come. So these conversations are forced to be had earlier.

Eric Brotman: It’s also helpful just in general, but specifically when we’re talking about housing, it’s, it’s important to know if one of your kids potentially is attached to, or would potentially like to have your house because that changes your financing options.

Eric Brotman: It changes your, your, some of your decision-making and it may not be possible. You know, if you have junior wants the house junior may have to buy it from mom and dad. Cause they have no choice. They can’t stay there. Or, um, but just don’t just change the title and make it joint with one of your kids. You know, th that, that is a great way to mess up Thanksgiving forever by having the wills and the beneficiaries and all the things go wrong.

Eric Brotman: Um, you know, people, people will try and do things for convenience and really mess up other things. There’s, there’s a, um, there’s complexity that comes with that. And so making a decision, um, that’s potentially ill informed, even if it’s well intentioned can be really [00:46:00] problematic. So instead of doing that, if you have three children and one of your kids really would like the house, there’s nothing wrong with that.

Eric Brotman: If you’re in a position where you’re leaving assets behind, you can find other ways to equalize or share or discuss. And maybe that means you’re leaving something else to a brother or sister, or maybe it means there’s insurance dollars at play here. Or other things where maybe it means that you’re leaving a house behind, but you’re leaving it behind with a mortgage and your son or daughter can have the house, but they’re going to have to finance it.

Eric Brotman: There’s nothing wrong with that. Um, you know, but a lot of times what we hear from kids are we don’t, we don’t want your house. W we’re never living in it. We don’t want that house. So either sell it and don’t worry about it or keep it, but know that we’re going to sell it when the time comes. And that can be a very powerful conversation

Cody Niedermeier: lots, lots of options that need to be discussed, but I want to leave time for one or two questions. So why don’t we get into the last don’t, which is one of the most important [00:47:00] of to do with either wants to work is not that overestimating your finances. Uh, I believe you briefly touched on it earlier. Uh, me planning for retirement looks a little different than you because of those inflation and what a dollar today will look like in a dollar down the line.

Cody Niedermeier: Um, some people might think they’re way better off than they actually are. So what are some consequences of overestimating your finances and you know, how can we resolve that?

Eric Brotman: Uh, overestimating your finances when you’re 30 means that you’re also going to be bartending while you’re working a day job. Not that that’s the end of the world, but it means you’re going to need a side hustle of some kind, because, um, because you, you, a lot of times young people, when they buy homes, don’t realize that a mortgage payment and a rent payment are not the same animal.

Eric Brotman: I think, oh, my rent is $1,200 a month. My mortgage is only 1500. I can do that. What they don’t know is that now every time something breaks or needs to be fixed, it costs lots of money. [00:48:00] So whether it’s AC or roofing or, or anything else, and young people rush to buy homes a lot. And, um, while it’s, it’s, it’s great to want to do that and to want to build equity and to feel like it’s home ownership and all those things.

Eric Brotman: A lot of times, young people necessarily shouldn’t buy homes because they’re, they’re not yet with a significant other that they may want to live with down the road. Um, and if, if you own a home and your future fiance owns a home, and you’re going to decide, are we living in one of these or are we selling?

Eric Brotman: And we’re buying something together. There’s a lot of baggage around that and potentially a lot of expenses and a lot of hassle and a lot of other things. So, um, I’m not saying buying a home is a bad thing. I’m saying that the cost of buying a home is more than the mortgage payment. It’s a lot more than the mortgage payment because it’s replacement reserves.

Eric Brotman: It’s a new washer and dryer. It’s, it’s, it’s decorating in a totally different way. It’s window treatments, maybe not for you Cody, but, but for a lot of people out there there’s window treatments. Um, so, so buying a house is not the same and that’s for younger people for, for [00:49:00] older people, it’s less of a, it’s less of a need to work more and more of a need to understand that you’re always, your resources are always finite.

Eric Brotman: Okay. Bill, bill gates has finite resources. There are plenty that you and I could live on reasonably comfortable. But everyone’s finances are finite. So there’s always going to be a point where you can afford just about anything but not everything. So if you overshoot the target with housing, it will mean being forced to undershoot other targets like travel or leisure or recreation, or spending time with your kids or grandkids or, or helping with college.

Eric Brotman: Or you’re always going to have a give and take. You’re always gonna have to make these decisions. And if your withdrawal rate is unsustainable and by unsustainable, I mean anything north of 4%, unless you’re at least 80, anything less than 4% is becomes very dangerous because it is a recipe to run out of money.

Eric Brotman: It’s just a matter of how soon and, uh, And there’s [00:50:00] also a lot of, um, uh, there’s a lot of study about the sequence and series of returns and how that can impact your results. So if, if you were looking at a 20 year horizon and the first year is the best year ever, your 20 year horizon is totally different than if it’s 20 years in the first year happens to be the worst year ever.

Eric Brotman: And, and even though your average might be the same averages lie. And, and the reason that I say averages lie is I’ll give you a perfect example of how an investment works in this case. Um, let’s say you were to invest $50,000 for two years, and the first year you get a 50% return. And the second year you take a 50% loss, what’s your average return?

Cody Niedermeier: Significantly less .

Eric Brotman: Well then your average your average return is zero, but you have less money than you started with. Yep. And regardless of the order, in a simple situation like that, You’re looking at an average of zero, but you have less [00:51:00] money because it takes a hundred percent gain to make up for a 50% loss. So when it comes time to deal with, um, um, housing decisions in retirement, um, overestimating your finances is incredibly dangerous for older people because it means it will force you,

Eric Brotman: uh, you know, I look at it like an orchard. I talk a lot about an orchard with clients, where if you have resources, they bear fruit every year and you can pick fruit every year. That’s your yield, it’s your dividend, it’s your income, or it’s just a total return, but whatever it is, you can pick fruit every single year.

Eric Brotman: And hopefully you’re picking less fruit than the trees will bear such that every year, there’s a little bit more fruit. If you overspend, you’re chopping off branches, that is a recipe to have less and less and less fruit and to have to chop more and more and more branches. And at some point you’ll run out of money.

Eric Brotman: It’s just a matter of how soon. So, um, it it’s for young people, it’s important not to overestimate finances, just in terms of cashflow and what you can handle, [00:52:00] because you don’t want to wind up, you know, hanging from a visa credit line. But for older people, it’s, it’s even more serious because in a lot of cases, there’s no way to go make more and you would have to make some real hard decisions about what are you give up. Either what do you give up in your lifestyle or your healthcare or your, um, or your entertainment. And nobody wants to have a beautiful house and then not be able to leave it for 10 years. That’s a prison. It’s a nice prison, but it’s a prison. So some of it is making good decisions with that too. Wow.

Cody Niedermeier: And I think that does it for the do’s and don’ts of downsizing and retirement, but we definitely do have a, have a few questions.

Eric Brotman: Um, before, before we get to questions, can I throw out one more thing to think about that we didn’t talk about? And in that three to five year discussion, we started with. Declutter early, because I, I’m not suggesting that all people have been in homes for a long time are hoarders, but I [00:53:00] will suggest that the amount of stuff that you have that you think you might use someday, that you haven’t pulled out in 15 years is docking.

Eric Brotman: And so it’s important to declutter and do it while you’re alive and healthy so that you know what you’re looking at, because things that might’ve been treasured to you that you want to share with somebody or give to somebody could wind up at 1-800-GOT-JUNK if you don’t do it yourself. And that’s kind of a sad outcome for things that maybe meant something to you that you haven’t been able to share.

Eric Brotman: So I’ll leave it at that. But yes, deep declutter declutter sooner, rather than later, don’t wait until there’s a tragedy. It’s incredibly hard to do.

Cody Niedermeier: Yeah, fair enough. But, uh, so bear with me on this first one. It’s a, it’s a little hefty. I just don’t want to summarize it and miss anything that was trying to be asked.

Cody Niedermeier: We have the question of, should I decide to move either to another state or stay in my current state? How do I financially or logistically manage buying or renting a new place at the same time I will be [00:54:00] selling my current home, which does have a mortgage.

Eric Brotman: And some of this is some of this is just a math problem.

Eric Brotman: Okay. And some of it’s figuring out what resources are available. If you have to be a contingency buyer, which means you have to sell your present home before you can afford to buy your new home, whether you’re going to another state or whether you’re moving to the next block. If you have to be a contingency buyer where you can’t buy without selling first, that creates some challenges.

Eric Brotman: It creates financing challenges and timing challenges, because you may have an easier time finding something to buy than you do finding something to sell. And you could wind up inadvertently with two homes and extra payments, and we’ve seen folks get stuck. The fact that it’s a sellers market right now makes that a little less likely, but historically there’ve been times where people have wound up with two homes and in real trouble because they’ve, they’ve overshot the target.

Eric Brotman: One thing you can do is you can sell your home, your existing home prior to buying and you can [00:55:00] sell it with a lease back. And so that means you can actually sell your home, but, but buy as a, as a tenant, an extra month or two or three to stay in the home before you move out where you’re actually paying rent to the person who just bought your house and that’ll that buys you time for the next purchase.

Eric Brotman: So that’s one option. Another option is, um, is to make sure if you do have a mortgage, do you have a line of credit? Is your line of credit enough to pay a down payment on a new property? And so what you sometimes can do, let’s, let’s say I’m not gonna make up numbers, but let’s say you have enough of a line of credit to buy, to do a down payment on your new home.

Eric Brotman: And you’re moving to Naples, Florida. Cause everybody in Maryland goes to Naples, Florida. If you go to Naples, Florida, you buy the new house. You, you did the down payment, but you had to finance that note and maybe the mortgage is bigger than you want it to be because you haven’t sold your existing home.

Eric Brotman: Once you sell your existing home, a lot of mortgage companies, and you can ask this of your lenders, [00:56:00] have the ability to recast a mortgage. So you don’t actually have to go through a refinance, but you can pay the mortgage down and reset it. Usually at the same interest rate, such that the payment will drop over the amortized period.

Eric Brotman: That’s a mouthful, but essentially it means you don’t have to, you don’t have to worry as long as you sell within a reasonable amount of time and you can recast the debt. You don’t get stuck. With a mortgage you don’t want, we’re having to spend five, $10,000 to refinance potentially at a higher rate. Um, just because you didn’t have the wherewithal to make the down payment.

Eric Brotman: Another thing to consider for folks downsizing. If you’re moving to a house where you can legitimately retire, where it’s really the last house you’re going to buy house apartment, kind of whatever, if that’s true, there are reverse financing options, or you can do a reverse purchase or a reverse mortgage where a reverse line of credit that might allow you to get in that house, less expensively in terms of out of pocket [00:57:00] and not have a payment, um, reverse mortgages scare people.

Eric Brotman: They scare people a lot because they can be extremely predatory. They’re expensive and they scare people, but like any other financial tool use properly, they can be a godsend. So I don’t like to paint any financial tool typically as a, uh, as good or bad. It may or may not work for you. So I hope I answered that question.

Eric Brotman: Um, logistically if you’re moving to another state, find a realtor in that state to help you and ask your realtor here to, to, to help guide you or ask your financial advisor to help you. Um, I would not just do a Google search candidly.

Cody Niedermeier: Awesome. Well, I think that that kind of brings us to the end of, uh, of our presentation.

Cody Niedermeier: Uh, just so all the listeners and viewers know, uh, you guys are going to receive the recorded copy of this. Uh, we have Eric’s information. If you want to contact, follow him, he’s putting out material left and right free resources for a whole bunch of things. Uh, so please don’t hesitate [00:58:00] to give them a follower or anything on these lines.

Cody Niedermeier: And then we actually have a barcode here for a free consultation. So a free conversation, uh, with one of our lead advisors, uh, where any of the questions that we didn’t touch on during our, uh, our webinar today. Cause obviously we ran a little tight on time. Uh, you’ll be able to ask those questions there.

Cody Niedermeier: And if you actually become a client in the future, or we build a financial planning relationship together, there’s actually going to be a 10% discount on the initial fee. So, you know, we have all these resources, we have the e-books, the podcasts, um, brotmanmedia.com is where you can find everything. Uh, and please don’t hesitate to reach out if you have any questions or you need anything from us.

Cody Niedermeier: Uh, both Eric and I hope this was helpful. And you guys were able to take something away from it. And Eric, I just wanted to say thank you. Uh, once again, I really appreciate you being on and, uh, you’re actually, uh, coming back in April, we have, uh, April 14th, our next webinar, uh, [00:59:00] practice makes perfect, uh, practicing for retirement when you are still working will be the next spot or the next webinar. Excuse me. And, uh, Eric, thank you. Once again,

Eric Brotman: Cody. My pleasure, first of all, April 14th is my wedding anniversary. So yes, I’m doing the webinar that day, but my bride and I would like a present if you don’t mind. Uh, I believe that that barcode, if, if I understand it correctly, you can actually take a picture of that or line your cell phone up with it right now and go directly to the portal to do this online and the, and to schedule time with, with one of our eight advisors and we’d love it.

Eric Brotman: That’d be a ton of fun.

Cody Niedermeier: Yeah. Then, like I said, any questions you might have, or we weren’t able to address today during the meeting because we actually received a lot in the, uh, the question in chat. Uh, that’s the time to ask those questions and we’ll be able to help you with anything, uh, you might be wondering about, or, you know, you want to work together to resolve, but, uh, Eric, thank you again, everyone.

Cody Niedermeier: Once again, this is coming, uh, going to be coming to you in an email. So this barcode will be, uh, attached in the presentation. And, uh, [01:00:00] I really appreciate you guys tuning in to listen.