How to Buy a House Without a Buyer’s Agent with Nick Aufenkamp

Eric Brotman [00:00:01]:
Welcome to Don’t Retire, Graduate, the podcast that asks you what you wanna be when you grow up so you can graduate into retirement with a purpose and a passion. I’m your host and valedictorian, Eric Brotman. And after nearly 200 episodes and a year long hiatus, Don’t retire, graduated back for season six. We’ll be bringing you interviews with amazing guests every other Thursday. And on alternating weeks, we’re hosting a new segment called diary of a financial advisor, which we know you’ll all enjoy. So please subscribe and check out our new episodes every Thursday. Today, I’m pleased to be joined by Nick Aufenkamp. Nick is a real estate agent gone rogue.

Eric Brotman [00:00:38]:
After helping over a hundred clients close on over a hundred million dollars of real estate, he’s now teaching home buyers how to purchase a home without the need to hire a buyer’s agent or something to that effect. So says the bio. Nick, welcome to Don’t Retire Graduate.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:00:54]:
Hey Eric, thank you so much for having me on. It’s a honor to be here.

Eric Brotman [00:00:58]:
Well, we’re going to have some fun today because I, you know, I know everyone can do almost anything for themselves. You can change your own tire. You can probably do your own root canal if you want, but I’ve bought three homes in my life. I consider myself reasonably savvy and I’ve never done it on my own. I’ve always used an agent for better or for worse. And you’re going to tell us why it’s for worse, I guess. But first, tell us how you got into the real estate business and, and sort of how you, how you went rogue. Yes.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:01:25]:
That is a a fantastic question. And just to clarify, I, as much as I love being the DIY guy, I I do not advise anybody try their own root canal. So I do have some limits as to my DIY, push. But I got into, real estate a little bit less traditional path than most. I, was in pastoral ministry and was looking for a way to make a bit of extra money, and so started to get into real estate investing. And had a friend of mine who was a realtor, great guy. And as I started buying properties, I kept looking at these closing statements though and seeing just how much he was making on each deal, $12.14, $17,000 on on some of these, transactions. And so I was like, man, if I’m gonna get serious about this, I should really learn how to represent myself and reduce transaction costs.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:02:18]:
But at that point, I didn’t realize that there was even a category for self representation. And so I was like, well, I guess I need to get my real estate license. And this was all around the time of the world shutting down with COVID. And so, my family and I made a big transition. We moved from Minnesota back to my hometown in the Portland Metro, Portland, Oregon side. And so I got my real estate license, started working for a home builder, local home builder. And that was a unique experience because while I was, learning about homes, still doing some real estate investing, most of the home buyers that I worked with in the new construction industry were self represented buyers. They didn’t have their own buyer agent.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:03:04]:
And so my exposure to the industry was, okay. I’m learning to buy properties myself. I’m helping people on the other end of the deal buy property, new construction without an agent. And then about a year, year and a half ago, I went out on my own, to just do my own real estate business, helping people buy and sell. And the more that I was helping my buy side clients, the more I realized these are highly competent people. A lot of them are CEOs or doctors. They they have a ton of competence and skill. They just don’t have the specific education about the deal, transaction flow of a real estate deal.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:03:46]:
And if they did, I think they could handle this whole process themself. So I talked with one of my friends, that was, about ready to to purchase a home and, asked him and and his wife if they would wanna be my guinea pig on this, DIY journey. And, they said, woah. We could save they’re buying a little over a million dollar home. They said, woah. We could save over $30,000 in in buyer agent commissions. It’s like, yeah. You could.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:04:16]:
And so that that was a pretty easy sell for them. And, I really then got to experiment with this kind of third way of helping people buy a home, where they’re not completely on their own, but they truly are self represented. So that might be a a long windy road, but that’s how we got here.

Eric Brotman [00:04:37]:
So so you you were talking about buying, DIY. You were not talking about selling DIY. Is that, is that true? Or are you suggesting that also? You’re just suggesting about the buy side. Okay. That makes sense. Got

Nick Aufenkamp [00:04:51]:
it. I am. Yep.

Eric Brotman [00:04:52]:
So I I’ve always had a problem with buyer’s agency. And, and I, I learned this at a young age when I bought my first home and every time I bought a home, it strikes me that if you are hiring a buyer’s agent, you’re hiring someone to represent your best interests. And what that means is you want them to help you get the best deal on a, a terrific house and to make sure that whatever you’re buying is number one, up to snuff and passes all the inspections and such, but also that you’re getting a fair, if not terrific deal on the house. The problem is the buyer’s agent makes more money. If you get a worse deal.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:05:26]:
Right.

Eric Brotman [00:05:27]:
That strikes me as inherently a conflict. I get it on the seller side. The more the seller can get you in terms of the deal, the more money they make. I’m okay with that. Mhmm. But on the buyer side, they really get paid more if you do the transaction sooner without negotiating it, and you pay more than you should. And that just strikes me as a problem. So if you’re solving that problem, I I can’t wait to learn more about the Homebuyer Academy.

Eric Brotman [00:05:49]:
Tell me more.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:05:51]:
Yeah. That was another huge piece of it for me as, you know, the way I’m wired is I want to bring as much value to the world as I I possibly can. That’s just kind of been part of my DNA. And the fact is as I was closing more and more of these buy side transactions, just thinking about the amount of money I’m making on each deal relative to the amount of value that I’m bringing. And, honestly, it was pretty rare that I was saving more people or people more money than the amount that I was walking away from, or away with at the end of each day. And, that was starting to grate on me. And then as I looked at the industry on the whole, you you’ve put your finger exactly on it. There is a complete misalignment of incentive structure between the buyer’s agent and the buyer client because it’s yes.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:06:48]:
As you said, the more that a buyer spends on a commission based arrangement, the more the buyer’s agent is going to make. And the quicker that a buyer’s agent can get their client to purchase a home, the quicker that buyer’s agent gets paid. And so you’re putting the buyer’s agent in a very awkward position where to look out for the best interests of their client, they are typically having to do what is, in their worst interest personally. And while I think there are good people and sincere buyer agents out there, I just don’t think that we should put people in that kind of a position where, for me to professionally help you, I’ve gotta do something that’s detrimental to myself. At least we shouldn’t have a system that’s designed that way that just expects every player to be extremely altruistic. And so I have wanted to the this DIY homebuyer academy is a way of saying, okay. How can we reimagine this process to make it more financially efficient and to align the incentive structures between the one who’s helping you buy a home and your ultimate goals, which is, like you said, to get the very best deal possible?

Eric Brotman [00:08:04]:
So I’m I’m enjoying looking at your at at part of your website. You look very uncomfortable in that photo, actually. In terms of, in in terms of getting started here, tell me more about the academy. Is this a is this an online course? Is it a an ongoing relationship? Is it a client, consumer type relationship? Is it is it just collateral materials? How how does it work?

Nick Aufenkamp [00:08:28]:
Yeah. Great question. So it’s a a community, a course, and one on one coaching. And the community and the course aspects of that, at least right now, those are entirely free. And so I encourage anybody who is even remotely interested in learning how to navigate the home buying process and how to do that from a do it yourself perspective to join the school community. That’s s k o o l. You can join the school community for DIY home buyer, and there, you’ll get to connect with myself and others that are actively going through the home buying process as DIY buyers. We do occasional live calls.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:09:12]:
I answer questions that are in the comments that anybody has. There’s a classroom with a free course that covers all the essentials of the home buying process with a bunch of downloadable materials. It’s a ton of value that’s absolutely free. And the reason that I’m giving it all away is because, one, realize that right now, everybody has a course, and there’s a lot of people on the Internet who’s not worth their salt when it comes to, education. And especially when we’re talking about one of the largest financial decisions that somebody’s gonna make, a new model for home buying, I want to, kinda tear down the wall to just say, hey. Here’s here’s who I am, and let me give away as much as I possibly can to you so that you can understand this process. So that’s the community and the course piece. Now the reality is every single transaction is unique.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:10:08]:
You’ve got unique individuals on the sell side, unique individuals on the buy side. And so any course is at most gonna be able to give you, like, 85% of the the transaction. But there’s gonna be that last 15% where some folks are gonna say, hey. I am convinced that I want to do it DIY, but I am not convinced that I wanna just go at this based upon a a course, and, hopefully, somebody answers my question in the community on time. And so for those folks, I do offer one on one coaching, and that is a a paid service. It’s a, it’s a monthly service so that, again, my, what you’re compensating me is not tied to your outcomes, in terms of commission based percentage. It’s also something that is gonna be a fraction of the cost of a a typical buyer’s agent. But that’s a package that we just put together based upon your unique situation and needs.

Eric Brotman [00:11:07]:
So you, you mentioned that this is sometimes the largest financial transaction in someone’s life. And, and I think that’s true. In fact, a lot of balance sheets you see for families, the biggest asset is their home. Are you working primarily with folks who are going to make this a primary or secondary residence for, for themselves or primarily with folks who are looking to do this for investment purposes? Or is there a good blend? Because it’s a totally different animal if you’re gonna live in it than if you’re gonna try and create, either rental income or resale value. So so who is your typical attendee of this academy?

Nick Aufenkamp [00:11:43]:
Yeah. You know, I, in initially building it, my thought was, well, this is gonna have the most value to people who are investors. But funny enough, the the majority of the clients that I’ve worked with so far have been folks that are buying primary residences. And they’re folks that have had bad experiences with buyer’s agents in the past where they they got burned. They had hoped that the buyer’s agent was gonna be looking out for their best interests. And in hindsight, they were left wanting, in that department. Or there are people that, again, like, I’ve worked with a couple of of doctors now that they’re just like, if somebody just taught me, gave me a little bit of guidance here, I should be able to figure this out. And, and they just prefer being able to be the one who is responsible entirely, for this this big decision.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:12:37]:
You know, I’ve kinda used the, the comparison before of it’s the difference between, hiring a buyer’s agent. Buyer’s agents will hate me for saying this, but hiring a buyer’s agent is kind of like calling for an Uber, where you get to set the the destination of where you wanna go, but you’re not the one behind the wheel. And so you are putting a lot of trust in the hands of of somebody else versus, DIY Homebuyer Academy model, which is, hey. You stay in the driver’s seat, but I’ll be your GPS system, giving you guidance, helping you detour when we run into roadblocks. But I’m not taking the autonomy out of your hands. There’s a lot of people that when it comes to the biggest decision of their their life financially, perhaps, they they don’t wanna hand over that control.

Eric Brotman [00:13:27]:
I I know there are some married couples out there who are thinking, you know, there’s no way I’m letting my husband or wife do this themselves. If if for no other reason than they’re thinking, I want someone to blame or I want my wife to have someone to blame if this goes wrong other than me. I mean, I’m sure there’s some of that happening, out there not to cast any aspersions on my own home, but that is, certainly a a possibility. There’s also other people involved in the real estate transaction. So for people who’ve never bought a home or for people who’ve bought one or two, it’s not just the realtor. And of course you have the buy side and the sell side realtor potentially. You have the buyer and the seller as as families or or property owners or what have you. But you also potentially have mortgage lenders, which means banks or financial institutions.

Eric Brotman [00:14:11]:
You might have, you certainly have a title company where someone who’s handling the the transfers and all the taxation and all the the legalities of it. You might have, you might be getting advice about this from your, from an attorney or a financial adviser or an accountant or others. So this could really be a large boardroom of humans. And you’re talking about eliminating one of them and and still saving a fair amount of money in the process. What’s the downside? What what do other than other than, you know, my wife saying this is my fault? What is the what is the real downside of DIY in your opinion?

Nick Aufenkamp [00:14:45]:
Yeah. Fantastic question because you’re right. There are a tremendous number of parties in a real estate transaction, a lot of eyes on these things. So the, potential downsides here are excuse me. I’m so sorry. My dog is growling. He almost never does this. Hopefully, we can

Eric Brotman [00:15:05]:
Look. He he I I mentioned I mentioned downsides, and he reacted as as he might. He’s like, oh, now you’re out you’re out to give Nick a difficult question, and I don’t like it. That’s fine.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:15:16]:
I’m so sorry about that. No.

Eric Brotman [00:15:17]:
Don’t don’t be sorry. Life happens.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:15:19]:
Alright. Yes. So the downsides, the potential downsides of doing it yourself are that you are taking on more responsibility yourself. There is going to be a higher commitment of time. Now I don’t think it’s tremendously higher amount of time, but you are going to be the one who’s doing all of your property research. You’re gonna be the one who is making the phone calls to the listing agent or to the seller. You’re the one who’s doing the back and forth and negotiations since showing up for, appraisals or home inspections. And at the end of the day, you are the one that that is responsible for what you’ve signed and for the decisions that you make throughout the process.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:16:07]:
Now I’m here to give you guidance, especially as your coach to help you with negotiation strategy, to help you with putting together comparative market analysis. But at the end of the day, you are the one that has the responsibility for those things. So that’s one potential downside. Now some people are saying, yeah. I I want that, and I I’ve got a little bit of extra time. It’s worth it to me to I would be attending all those things anyway. That’s fine. The other downside is that, this model is new, and the real estate industry is extremely resistant to change.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:16:44]:
And that’s one of the most unfortunate things that I have seen is that a lot of self representing DIY homebuyers, they’ve been met with resistance by listing agents because, listing agents often also serve as buyer’s agents, and they, stand to lose business if DIY home buying becomes more of the norm. And so that’s definitely something that, I feel like I’m playing both a educator role as well as a consumer advocacy role to help make a legitimate pathway that’s widely recognized for self representing buyers.

Eric Brotman [00:17:25]:
The real estate industry has had, a very interesting monopoly on this process for a very long time. So to your point, I can appreciate why they’re not excited to lose potentially half of the revenue from a transaction, which you’re right. I mean, somebody who’s a seller’s agent on Tuesday might be a buyer’s agent for somebody else on Wednesday or even the same afternoon. So that that makes sense to me. There are significant associations and lobbying groups and and whether it’s the home builders associations or whether it’s the realtors and and all of the different, the the different lobbying groups. Is there a group of advocates for the DIY space, or is it still kind of the wild west here?

Nick Aufenkamp [00:18:08]:
It really is the the wild west here. I think that there are going to be more and more of these advocacy groups that are popping up, especially in light of the recent lawsuit and subsequent settlement against the National Association of Realtors, which I believe, gets approved here in November 2024. So there there’s a lot more attention that’s being turned towards consumer protection within, transacting real estate. I think that that’s a really good thing. And I think that with how much skepticism there is out there about, hey. Can I really trust my agent? What sort of, protections are in place? Who’s got oversight on the real estate industry? Those questions, I think, are gonna lead to a lot of positive change within the industry over the coming years. But, unfortunately, we are sort of I believe in the infancy, of that, that there there’s been a lot of gatekeeping. There hasn’t been a lot of transparency, and so we’re just starting to see some really positive changes on those fronts.

Eric Brotman [00:19:15]:
And some of the the real estate brokerages are now calling themselves, what they’re calling themselves discount brokerages, they’re working for less than the traditional. I’m sure they were met with terrible resistance too. There are probably some, some highly compensated real estate firms who say don’t work with those folks because they’re undercutting us and, and so forth. And so it’s a little bit territorial. Are you seeing that within the real estate community as well? I mean, so many realtors to me, it’s like 10% of the realtors do 90% of the business and the other 90% of realtors sell a house a year. Am I is that my imagination or is that true?

Nick Aufenkamp [00:19:51]:
No. You’re you’re absolutely right. It’s it is really crazy, like, how thin it is up at the top, how it’s such a small percentage of agents that are making insane money because of the volume of transactions that they’re doing. And it’s funny because for some of them are legitimately just incredible negotiators, incredible agents, especially on the the listing side. But the, the barriers to entry to get into real estate have been so low. In the past with buyer agent commissions, the the buyer’s agent never had to negotiate commissions. It was just a given that the seller was gonna be paying some percentage. And so you had a lot of folks that got into the industry because they’re like, hey.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:20:42]:
Even if I just sell one or two homes a year, you know, 3% of $700,000, that’s $21,000. That’s worth it to me to get licensed. If I’ve got a a a niece or nephew that’s gonna be buying a home sometime in the next year or so, I can I can be the friends and family agent? And so there there wasn’t really high expectations, and it was like you could be a a part time agent essentially making, the the same amount as a top performing agent per transaction. So that that has led to, I think, a a glut of folks coming in that the top performing agents, their business, some of it’s selling homes, but, really, it’s, lead generation. Yeah. You know, that’s that’s the business that they’re in is is getting leads and getting new clients to work with. And so the number of sellers and buyers that talk about, as soon as they sign the agreement with their agent kinda getting ghosted by them, is it’s alarming, the the number of times that happens. And I do see a lot of new models popping up.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:21:44]:
It’s funny. Like, even the idea of a a discount broker, is a bit disparaging and speaks to the issues within the industry because they say that all commissions are supposed to be negotiable and that, this this industry is built, to have competition and that that competition is supposed to con serve the consumer. But then we’ve got traditional agents that label anybody new that comes to town as the discount broker that isn’t gonna give you the full services that a a traditional agent would, and they disparage them and kinda outcast them that way. We saw that happen especially with Redfin early on. Redfin’s really the only one that’s been able to kinda push through a lot of that noise. So hopefully more models will will pop up, flat fee models, hourly models, but it’s, like you said, it’s it’s kind of the wild West right now.

Eric Brotman [00:22:38]:
Well, I I’ve read some of your stuff, Nick, and I and I saw the rock star realtors versus the door holders. And and I love that, though it’s it’s not the kindest thing to call somebody a door holder necessarily, but I I get it. I mean, it, especially since most of the time, I feel like the the consumer’s the one who says, oh, I found this house online or I saw it in my neighborhood or whatever. I wanna go check it out. And all they’re really doing is getting a guided tour. So I I I feel you. I sort of get that. Tell me let’s talk a little bit about the the title process because that to me is the scary part, not the buying and selling and the negotiating.

Eric Brotman [00:23:12]:
I mean, heck, I’m a financial guy. I can do that. But the title work is where you sit down at a table, usually at the last second. Money is being wired somewhere, sometimes a lot of money, and you’re signing your name 78 times on things you have no shot at reading. And if you read them, you’re not gonna understand them. And if you read them and understand them, you’re not gonna remember them anyway. Like, what is wrong with that process? Is this just, and, and maybe we can beat on some lawyers for a little bit together, but is this just over lawyering where everything is disclosed, but then nothing is useful because it’s a, it’s a phone book full of full of of forms?

Nick Aufenkamp [00:23:49]:
Right. I mean, I I do think that that, is a huge part of the the problem. We kinda live in a society that’s been over lawyered in so many ways. You think of the terms and conditions that you’re given anytime you sign up for a new service online, and, you know, you can’t scroll through that thing quickly enough before hitting accept and agree. And, unfortunately, the the title process

Eric Brotman [00:24:12]:
You don’t read those entirely?

Nick Aufenkamp [00:24:14]:
I’m the only one giving myself away.

Eric Brotman [00:24:16]:
I’m the only one who reads that every time Apple does something. Oh, I it was silly. I I you’re right. You just nod, smile, and accept, and now they own your house. I mean, it’s unbelievable. But, alright, I I didn’t mean to interrupt you, but it was a great analogy.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:24:29]:
I I love it. Yeah. Yeah. It’s, so I do think that’s that’s a part of it. But, you know, it’s that’s one thing when you’re, when you’re accepting terms and conditions on a service that’s $7 a month, that’s a whole different thing when you’re spending $700,000 plus on a home. And you do want to be really aware of what it is that you’re signing. I think that, title companies and, a lot of those documents tend to be, loan documents, origination kind of things, stuff that’s required by the lender. Title companies and loan officers, I think, are trying to do a better job at getting those documents out earlier for folks to be able to review prior to signing.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:25:14]:
But there’s a couple of things. You know, it’s a little bit ironic that we talk about the, these things being over lawyered. And then one of my recommendations is you can hire a real estate attorney to be in the room with you at closing to help you review anything. You know? And, again, it feels like, well, it’s incredibly self serving to the whole lawyer industry. But, frankly, a a real estate attorney is going to be able to look out for your interests in that situation a lot better than most real estate agents are. Real estate agents don’t have a a legal background. Yeah. They’re gonna be more familiar with those documents, but they actually can’t give legal advice outside of a very limited purview of the purchase and sale agreement.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:25:59]:
And so, the the agent doesn’t serve a whole lot of value other than just kinda giving you the smile and thumbs up like, yep. This is normal. Or, hey, Mac, maybe we should pause here and and then call in the the the big boys to look at these numbers. So I’m gonna cut that out by just having a a real estate attorney. Otherwise, you know, you can, as awkward as it feels, go slow, ask the the title agent, questions. They’re a third party to the transaction. They don’t have any stake one way or the other, and so they’ll explain things to the best of their ability. And if there’s anything that feels fishy or off, you know, to just hit pause on the whole thing until you get the clarity that you need.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:26:42]:
I think people can feel pressured in those moments. It’s exciting. It’s emotional, but it it is well worth just taking your time on those and and not rushing through signing.

Eric Brotman [00:26:52]:
Well, I I think the pressure is enormous. If you’ve already sold your home and you’re settling on a house and getting the keys that day, and you have to put something on hold the stress there. Now you feel homeless for a period of time. In addition, you say the title company doesn’t have an ax to grind one way or the other. They don’t have a side, But their only incentive is that the deal get done. So they wanna grease the skids one way or the other. And then let’s, while we’re putting buyer’s agents under the bus, and we’re gonna have no friends left after this, by the way. But while we’re doing that, how about, how about the lenders? The lenders who, who, who are not in a position to tell you how much house you should consider that’s for the financial advisors.

Eric Brotman [00:27:29]:
They’re gonna tell you how much you can qualify for, which is pushing the envelope just as far as they can so that they get paid the most possible. So now your buyer’s agent’s gonna find you the, the, the worst deal on the biggest house they can get you in based on what the mortgage company can qualify you for. And you just paid extra for everything without having any real advocacy for yourself. All right. I’m off my soapbox. I did go all Joe Rogan today and I feel bad, but Nick, I, I don’t, I don’t know how to thank you for this. I I’m gonna make sure that folks know how to check out your, your information, but I can’t let you off the show and off the hook without asking a fundamental question, which is, what do you wanna be when you grow up?

Nick Aufenkamp [00:28:09]:
Yeah. You know, it’s a simple, answer for me. It it really comes down to and I’m sorry if this feels like dodging it, but, I want to be the best father that I possibly can. And and the thing is is that I’m I’m on my way. I’ve got three kids. But I I can’t say that I’m I’m there yet because they’re and I’ll always, you know, hopefully be dad. So it’s kinda like one of those, how do I know when I’ve arrived, when I’ve grown up? But I I hope that that one day I’ll know, and and that’s that’s the real motivation underneath everything that I’m doing. I see an opportunity to make a difference, to set an example for them, to bring what I believe is positive change to, an industry that desperately needs it.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:28:54]:
And it’s a it’s a big thing to tackle, and that’s exactly the message that I want to send to my kids of, hey. When you see problems in the world, when you see things that don’t feel right to you, You have the the autonomy and the the power and to a degree to to whatever degree you’re capable of responsibility to go forward and and make a change. And, I believe that that value comes back around to us and that, in what I’m building here, that it’ll it’ll provide well to set my my kids up for for their futures, too. So that that’s what it really boils down to for me is just when I grow up, when I’m looking back at the end of my days, I I hope that I’ve done an amazing job as a dad.

Eric Brotman [00:29:36]:
Well, Nick, number one, you’re bringing a lot of value to this industry and you’ve given a lot of free resources and we’ll put them all in the in the show notes. And it sounds like the world needs a lot more dads like you too. So I congratulate you on an excellent answer. Not that there’s a grade for this. This is an ungraded assignment, but nonetheless, it was an excellent answer. How can folks learn more about the Homebuyer Academy and and more about you, Nick?

Nick Aufenkamp [00:29:59]:
Yeah, thanks so much, Eric. This has been so fun. And yeah, like I mentioned a moment ago, the best place to connect with me is gonna be at that school community, sk00l.com/diyhomebuyer. Joining the community there, like I said, you’ll have to set up an account with school, but otherwise, it’s entirely free. That’s where you can ask me questions directly, engage with the course. If you just wanna learn more about the DIY Homebuyer Academy, you can go to DIYHomebuyerAcademy.com. You can also find me on all of the social media places at DIY Homebuyer. So whether that’s TikTok or x or YouTube, those are the places that I’m most active.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:30:41]:
Would love to connect with folks there.

Eric Brotman [00:30:43]:
Nick, you’ve given our listeners a lot to think about. And, even though you’re not doing your own root canal, you didn’t rule out doing your own tire change. So I give you credit for that. Thanks for joining us on Don’t Retire, Graduate. It’s been a pleasure getting to know you.

Nick Aufenkamp [00:30:57]:
Thank you so much, Eric.

Eric Brotman [00:30:59]:
I’d like to thank all of you for listening and watching today. If you enjoy our show, please subscribe, leave a rating on your favorite podcast platform and share it with your friends and family so they can join you on your journey to financial freedom. If you’d like to send us a topic or idea you’d like to discuss in a future episode of don’t retire graduate, please post it on our Facebook page or tweet us at Brotman planning. We’ll be back next week with another entry in our diary of a financial advisor. And in two weeks with another engaging guest for now, this is Eric Brotman reminding you don’t retire, graduate.

Unnamed Voiceover [00:31:36]:
Securities offered through Kestra investment services LLC, Kestra IS, member FINRA SIPC, investment advisory services offered through Kestra advisory services LLC. Kestra AS, an affiliate of Kestra IS. Kestra IS or Kestra AS are not affiliated with Brotman financial or any other entity discussed.